The Lisbon thing & Fabfiveferg putting his foot in it

[Richie L]

"In my view if you vote no, all you get is more of the same (see johns comment), more political corruption right on your doorstep still no european charter of human rights, still no children's rights, workers rights in ireland are nothing to shout about and we are still economically and politically bankrupt, with the wolves i mean IMF at the door"

With a ratification of the treaty foreign investors can set up business here and employ their own nationals at the pay rates of the donor country.Fact.So how does that translate to better workers rights.?Its the opposite.It means exploitation of those who dont have a job at the moment.It means an end to a minimum wage set in Ireland for people who work in Ireland,not all granted,but some.Thats called dicrimination.It means a convergence of salaries to the lowest commom denominator if your not a professional.How will these people live here on the national Polish minimum rate?Sounds like a recipe for racial tension and ghetto style stuff.This thing is dressed up lovely with a few deep scars embedded in the skin of it.
Europe has given us money in the past.Yes.Have you ever considered why?
I think its because the people who ran the show here prior to Europe did not plan,invest,innovate,care,bother,consider, and be professional.Maybe if we had decent politicians and other social partners in the first place we would not hang everything on Europe as the only way out?Then and now.Brussels and Frankfurt are populated by the same people with the same fundamental basic truths still.Same people in a different place with greater opportunity to mess up our lives.McCreevy was a clown here and he is a clown in Brussels.Another fact.I do not have an answer except to vote no.I am going out to do that now.

[Stig]

I am going out to do that now.

I was down my polling station earlier, and Voted NO.

There Cowan & Co and your EU cronies, stick that in your euro pipe and smoke it!

[Ivan]

Thanks Richie i was too busy too type all that out.
Suppose you had time while waiting for your ink to arrive

I'm voting later i want to savour it a while longer....mmmmmmm voting

[Stig]

Thanks Richie i was too busy too type all that out.
Suppose you had time while waiting for your ink to arrive

I'm voting later i want to savour it a while longer....mmmmmmm voting

lol

[ger]

How will these people live here on the national Polish minimum rate?

They wont, this is firstly untrue and secondly who would come from poland to work for the money they can get in poland? Our minimum wage is in place and will still apply.

Where are you getting this information from?
Show me the article in the treaty that refers to minimum wages?

Have you read even the shorter version of the treaty?

as i said earlier "I admire anyone who is making an educated informed choice regardless of the side they fall on, as for the rest…"

Thanks Richie i was too busy too type all that out.

Too busy worrying about the future of porsche maybe?

I have taken time to answer the views of the no side in full.
And still no one has debated my main points.

Just the same old NO side rhetoric

Its easy to pick out a bit of a post, quote it and give your view, why not try responding to posts in full?

I have to say I am pretty disappointed at the lack of informed debate on this issue.
Its just repetition of the sound bites from radio and TV, think for yourselves please and that does not necessarily mean voting Yes.

[Richie L]

It's in the long version.Thats why its not in the short version.My point is they dont want you knowing this.And guess what,you dont.Looks like another uninformed comment so on this tread.Oops!
I also said our minimum wage will still exist but only for some.Please dont misquote me.
As before we will attract foreign investment through tax breaks.They will set up here if the costs allow.What about the plethora of companies leaving here to set up in India for cheaper labour.Its the same thing.Its not uninformed to understand things as they actually are.You need to open your eyes to a bigger picture and I value your opinion too without trying to poo poo it.

[Ivan]

.

Just the same old NO side rhetoric

Just the same old YES side rhetoric.

Thats the problem with the treaty it can be twisted either way.
At the end of the day i don't want to hand any more power over to the EU.

[ger]

It's in the long version.

Show me the article?

[Stig]

How will these people live here on the national Polish minimum rate?

And still no one has debated my main points.

maybe no one wants to?
cos you sound like Dick Roache or the like

[ger]

They will set up here if the costs allow.What about the plethora of companies leaving here to set up in India for cheaper labour.Its the same thing.Its not uninformed to understand things as they actually are.You need to open your eyes to a bigger picture and I value your opinion too without trying to poo poo it.

This is globalisation, its been going on for decades and has nothing to do with the treaty.

again, show me the article?

[ger]

maybe no one wants to?
cos you sound like Dick Roache or the like

1916 bla bla, you sound like gerry adams

[Stig]

They will set up here if the costs allow.What about the plethora of companies leaving here to set up in India for cheaper labour.Its the same thing.Its not uninformed to understand things as they actually are.You need to open your eyes to a bigger picture and I value your opinion too without trying to poo poo it.

This is globalisation, its been going on for decades and has nothing to do with the treaty.

again, show me the article?

Badgering does'nt make what you say right??? Does it?

[ger]

Badgering does'nt make what you say right??? Does it?

What are you on about, all i asked for was the article in the treaty which confirms the point, its black and white.

[Ivan]

They will set up here if the costs allow.What about the plethora of companies leaving here to set up in India for cheaper labour.Its the same thing.Its not uninformed to understand things as they actually are.You need to open your eyes to a bigger picture and I value your opinion too without trying to poo poo it.

This is globalisation, its been going on for decades and has nothing to do with the treaty.

again, show me the article?

Well then how can the treaty provide jobs? & recovery.


(i'm really enjoying this, at last a debate with someone on the yes side, thanks ger)
Ps have you voted yet? are we turning you?

[Stig]

Badgering does'nt make what you say right??? Does it?

all i asked for was the article in the treaty which confirms the point.

numerous times.....